Category: philosophy/religion topics
Okay, this is a subject that I hope and pray it doesn't cause any problems. But I want your honest heart felt opinions. As a Christian, is it biblically wrong to date someone outside of your race or culture? If so, give your biblical reasons as to why it is wrong. Just curious to here what you all think. Thank you.
I'm extremely interested in hearing the answers as well. I've never heard Christians say it was wrong to date outside their faith, though I have heard the really conservative Jews frown upon it. It would certainly be an interesting problem if a couple of dramatically different religious or ethnic backgrounds, both of whom felt very strongly towards their faith/culture, had a child. I could definitely foresee struggle there. Personally, I always date within my own race and usually within my own culture, but religion doesn't play an important part in whom I'm dating. So long as he's tolerant, understanding and respectful towards me and doesn't proselitise, I offer the same in return. But if he says no sex before marriage, or that I must submit to him because I'm a woman, he's out. Anyway, back to the topic. Christian views?
As a Christian, which I'm not, the topic of dating outside one's race was something that came after the bible. The bible does speak of tribes, and slaves but not necessarily of race in the way which we think of it. Remember, one of the things which took place in biblical stories was the slaughter of towns, and the taking of the women. In other words, one group of people who were somewhat culturally diferent than another, would war, and one of the spoils of war was the ability to marry, take, a wife from the losing tribe.
From the beginning, christians were encouraged to be a multicultural group, Jews, Romans, and any other group of people could meet. The church was not just for Jewish followers of Jesus. One could assume that this meant marriages between cultures, and this was not uncommon from a historical perspective.
I do not see any way in which a Christian could defend marriage only between two people of the same "race" or ethnicity in terms of the bible.
the bible says not to be unequally yoked, which means christians and non christians should not married i've been told. don't know exactly where that is but paul said it. i know many biracial couples who are devout christians. don't think it should be an issue. i would think that if two people had strong religious beliefs which were dramatically different, if they can work it out between themselves, who are we to judge?
I cannot speak from a christian prospective. Muslims have nothing against dating someone from outside their own race. the Qur'an says: and we made you into nations and tribes so that you may recognise each other, not so that you may dispise each other. Racism is not an islamic concept. However muslims must marry muslims, that is a requirement. I should know...I tried to form a lreationship with one and that was one of the reasons, the most important in fact, that it did not work.
This is an issue that hits close to home. I was in an interracial relationship for almost a year and a half, and the main reason I heard over and over for why my family and others frowned upon it was that I was going straight to hell. I was never given specific biblical passages, so I did some research on my own. I honestly became obsessed with finding the answer. But as with most controversial issues, it seems that the more liberal the Christian is, the more likely they're going to be to say that the Bible doesn't say anything about it. However, I will share 2 articles that I found that cover both sides of the issue.
Personally, I don't think I would date outside my race again. The relationship I was in did not end because of the racism and hatred that was directed at me from all sides while I was in it, but I feel that it caused me too much drama and heartache. My family relationships were almost destroyed because of it, and now I struggle with the concept of forgiveness because it was drilled into my head that God would never ever forgive me for doing this. I haven't gone to church in years, and quite frankly I'm scared to do so because I don't want the positions people have taken to be reaffirmed by someone who knows what they're talking about, such as a pastor. But anyway, here are those articles, hopefully they will help you make up your own mind about the situation.
This one is pro-interracial dating:
http://www.christiananswers.net/q-sum/sum-g003.html
And this one, against it. Warning: this may be offensive to some. I know it made me quite angry.
http://www.stormfront.org/truth_at_last/archives/interracial.htm
I think having kids with someone from a different culture and, especially, religion can be very difficult, especially if both people feel strongly about their religion.
I have my doubts as to how viable such a relationship/family will be, honestly, not saying it can't be done, but I think a lot of people do not foresee the problems when they start going out.
And I think this is much worse of a problem than, say, ratial dating. Yu can have a white and a black person that go to the same church, born in the same city with similar parents, and so really they are not so much different at all, whereas say a Christian and a Jewish person may, and likely will, have issues.
Wow. That sounds horrible. Personally, if my family ever treated me like that, I'd disassociate myself from them, regardless of whether the relationship worked out or not. The fact that they wouldn't be able to see that I'm truly happy and that my partner and I love each other and would honestly hate him because of his race/culture, and more so, that they would threaten me over it, would tell me that they're not worthy to be in my life. I wouldn't be thrilled if I had a child and he/she were to do it, but as his/her mother, so long as my child was happy and truly loved, I'd have no choice but to support his/her decision. After all, I'm not the one in the relationship.
In my opinion, it is totally fine. We are one body, so why not? The only tricky thing is to marry someone outside the faith. God is not violently against it I think, but he says a believer should not be unequally yoked. Having said that, agan, I think it's okay to date and marry someone outside once culture and rase.
To post 8, it's good that you wouldn't forbid your child to date outside their race, but just out of curiosity why wouldn't you personally be thrilled if they did?
My dream is to become a Greek citizen, through naturalisation and to marry a Greek man. Since I don't have the blood, I'd want my child to have it or at least citizenship through birth, since that law was newly passed. My hope would be that he/she goes with another Greek so that the blood gets stronger in the next generation and since I would have fought so hard to make it as an immigrant in Greece, I'd hate to see it and the culture become lost. If not, then I'd hope that my child at least chooses someone white. My major problem with interracial dating isn't the people themselves. It's the children that could result from such a union. Sometimes, they look absolutely beautiful because of the mixing, or you can't even tell that they're interracial. But even in those cases, they're often picked on and don't know where they belong. If you've ever heard the song Half Breed, you know what I mean. I don't think it's fair to subject a child to that. On the other hand, if two people honestly and trully love each other and feel that they can raise a child with the same love and strength, they should go for it.
screaming Turtle, the article you chose too look at which was against interracial marriage is probably one of the worst things you could have chosen. It's not scientific, it's not religious, it's not historically accurate, in other words, it's just a rant and nothing more. If you are to read things like that, do it for fun, not when you are soul searching.
As stated above,there are far greater complications than ethnicity, or "race." Financial Status, family and friend relationships, education, religion, all of these things can present larger problems. If your partner is Indian, and you are white, but you are both from middle class families, both of your fathers own their own business, you both have healthy family and friend relationships, and are both considerate of each others s religion, then everything might be fine. But if one of you is a democrat, and the other Republican, well then, things can be very different.
You're probably right about that. But I was having trouble finding anything useful on Google, either for or against it, so I was taking everything I could get. I'm not sure about the article's validity, but the person who wrote it claims to be a scholar of some sort, at least he has Dr. before his name. But this is the internet, after all, and I guess I should have taken that with a grain of salt. But my point in posting it here is that people do still think that way, most of the people I've known personally included. It obviously has a strong message, and whether it's right or wrong doesn't matter. My point was to show people 2 radically different opinions and see which one was honestly closer to their own beliefs, as well as the original poster who seems to be questioning such controversial issues.
Personally, I honestly don’t see what the big deal is about dating someone from a different race, but then again, I do not believe that race exists in the first place. While most people have the tendency to think that race is defined by biological factors, it is nothing more than a human invention used to classify people into various groups and categories.
Since blind people have a culture you should not date sited girls, this means there will be more for me since I'm not so closed minded.
OK, I just typed my post, and somehow the Zone deleted it. *Growl*
First, I do not agree with Crazy Cat that there is no such thing as race. If there wasn't, then why all the big deal about Obama being the first black President?
But I digress. As a Christian, I see nothing at all wrong with dating someone outside one's own race and/or culture. As I've said on another board, I personally need to be with someone who shares most of my religious beliefs. I want that spiritual connection with my partner, and do not think I could achieve it with someone who was a totally different faith than me.
I think that dating outside one's race or culture could be a very enriching experience for both parties. However, it seems that it might require extra communication while the couple is still in the dating stage. Things like the possibility of having kids, the reactions of family and friends, etc. If this is talked about, then that couple can remain a united front, whatever comes at them.
And, Screaming Turtle, I am so sorry to hear of your experience. I see nothing Biblically that would suggest anyone would go to Hell for an interracial relationship. That does not appear to be a salvation issue at all. To me, it's ideas like that which gives Christians in general a bad name.
as much as I have my own views and biasses, I must admit, as an anthropologist, that there really is no such thing as race. It doesn't exist in biology. It was a cultural invention based on the colour of one's skin, the superiority complexes of various cultures, and the lack of scientific evidence, at that time, to the contrary. That said, the idea has become so ingrained in certain cultures that it's now a tangible one and very real in the mindsets of these cultures.
I simply meant that there is no biological evidence to support the notion of race and that it is simply defined by one’s culture. Many countries define race differently, so it is not exactly something that is set in stone. For example, someone who is considered white in the United States could vary well be considered black in Brazil, and someone who is considered black in the United States may be considered colored in South Africa. And even within the United States, the categories of race have changed throughout the years. I understand race exists on a cultural level, but since it does not exist on a biological level, I choose not to believe in the assigned categories designated by society as a way to identify someone because most people don’t fit into those categories anyway.
to post 5: muslim can allow to date someone from different raice true, but also, some muslim force the non-muslim to convert to their relagion. not only that, also, take a muslim name, and abendon their old name, and family to certain degree. i'm not telling lie here, i witness it happen to few of my chinese friends in malaysia, who convert to muslim just because they married to muslim.
to the original post: i don't think if you are christian you are not allow to date other raices or relagion. but, you would have problems occur due to the crash of different relagion. for example, if you have children later on, how you want your children to bring up, in what relagion environment, etc etc. and if both of you have different relagion and commited to your own relagion, that could be a pertential problem between you and your partner too. i suppose, it come to the spiritual grow of you and your partner...
Yes but that's religion. If I, as a christian, date an African, who's a christian as well, this is a different culture, but certainly not a different religion, and the bible says nothing against that. So I agree with Alicia (Sister Dawn) that you don't go to hell when you date people outside your race, and it is true that judging about this has given us christians a bad name. And even if your parents are not happy about you as a white person dating a coloured person ... it is your choice and your conviction that counts.
And it shouldn't be your choice to date outside of your religion? And here's another interesting spin. Say you're both Christian but from very different denominations. How is that worked out? I'm being sincere here, not sarcastic.
Actually it doesn't work out, because Christians are different. I really don't believe any of this is God's way however. Hate is hate, so if you confess to be a Christian, then how could you hate, dislike, because someone skin is different? I stopped calling myself a Christian due to the differents in Christians. If you are baptis you will be different from Methodis, and so would not marry. Not even between churches most times. Some larger congregations have rules stating you can not even date outside that group. Love has not racde, culture, faith, religion, so to speak. Love is love, and God loves us all, so why should it be wrong to love a black woman if you are a white man, or any way you want to put it? If God wanted every one to be the same and God is all powerful then why differents? Un equally yoked means you should work together equally with your mate, but has nothing to do with religion nor faith. We all are born, and in the middle we all must live, and we all must die, so why should love be hampered with foolishness? It is hate and hate should play no part in religion. Skin color, culture, all have to do with where you are born on the earth for nature reasons, not for deviding. Now society can travel anyplace, so we mixed is all.
Peace.
Also I wanted to comeant on biracial children. In my family and others I know their are many, and they grow up normally, not teased, harassed, or anything such, so again that is a thought that should be done away with. A new baby has no pre conceived notions of raice, so this is a tought idea. Tell a child they are beautiful, productive, and normal, or not different that child will simply except this. If all around him or her don't point it out that child will not worry about it at all. It is fine to not want a biracial child, but it is not socially bad. It is simply a excuse to not date others. If you say I like white males that is a want, but not a need, if that makes sense and no part of God.
Eleni, I know you're curious and not trying to instigate stuff. Quite honestly, how it works out is between the couple themselves. Only they can determine if their differences in denominations are reconcilable in their own eyes. hopefully my response to Forereel below will expand on that answer to your question.
Forereel, I disagree with you on two points. First, I believe Christians of differing denominations can date/marry, and it can work just fine. I have seen this happen with several couples I am friends with personally, and have heard of other successful examples of it. So, though I'm glad you followed through on your own feelings and convictions, I think you are wrong to say that this can't work at all.
Second, unfortunately, the concept of race is indeed a reality in our society, whether you believe race actually exists or not. Those around a child, such as his/her parents, extended family, and friends can tell the child they are beautiful, etc, and they are right, and should be told that. However, no matter how loving and supportive the family or friends, eventually that biracial child is going to come into contact with outside society, and learn that indeed the concept of race is real, and that often, they are caught in the middle of it. Loved ones cannot, and should not, shelter a child from reality forever. All they can do is be supportive and teach their own ideals when that child does encounter the rest of society. and never have I stated that I am against people of different races having a child. I am simply stating that a biracial child's growing up may not be as simple as you seem to think.
I think interracial dating or dating outside of one's culture is fine. I think it would be a great experience to date a guy from another race/culture. Like others, I think religion is a much more serious factor. I am Christian, and would like to marry a Christian. It would be another issue if religion weren't important to one or both parties. But I have two friends who married, One Nondenominational Christian and the other Catholic (albiet a lapsed one). They can't agree on whether to baptize their baby in a Catholic church or Protestant one. I think if children are involved then the matter could really get complicated. I'm not saying it never works, but for me personally, I would definitely want a match in faiths. Race and culture are secondary to religion.
For me, religion takes second place in choosing a partner. As long as he doesn't try to force me to convert, put down my faith or have such radically different views that we can't agree on the major things in life, we'll be fine. At this point in my life, children aren't even a consideration in my mind, and I may never want any. But if I were to have one, I think this could be a problem if my partner were to insist that he/she be brought up either with his religion exclusively or with no religion at all. I never grew up with one and think it would be wonderful to raise a child as a Hellenic Polytheist who has appreciation for other faiths but who follows mine. Of course, what he/she did when he/she was old enough to make an informed decision I couldn't change, but I would at least like my child to have the foundations set.
I still do not understand why marrying someone from a different race should be such a big deal. The only reason why it is a problem is because we as human beings have labeled it as a problem. However, if you take a look back in history, you will find that the human races have been mixing with each other for centuries. Race is such a subjective thing that is difficult to define. On any given day, I could call myself Caucasian, Irish, or Native American depending on how I feel like defining myself on that particular day. And yes, at one point in time being Irish was labeled as a separate race. If anything, it seems as though the racial lines are drawn more on a collective shared history then it is by the color of one’s skin.
Quite true. Race means different things to different people. as you said, it's not only based on the colour of one's skin but on one's ethnicity etc.
Sweet sister. I did not say it could not work,meaning different Christian religions mixing. What I meant to say is offten times the churches set and have rules that state you should only date, marry a person in this church. Some even go as far to bring a person before a group to change their evil thinking. I have been involved with churches that do this. Now as far as these biracial kids, sure I agree that race is an issue, but again I have in my family some and they have grown up just fine. They are easy going people,. I also have friends that are mixed race and these are also well adjusted people, so it is possible to raise a biracial child well grounded even though race is an issue by telling him or her they are good productive people and not freaks. No you don't shelter them you teach them the people with the problem are stupid not them. It's like being blind. Your different right, but you deal and you seem well adjusted, so. Smile. Should we pass a law on biracial kidsso they don't run in to the dumb?
That anti-interracial website was just awful... I didn't read it all because I couldn't get past the grammatical errors - clearly he's never heard of something called "spell check".
I do note that at the bottom of the page the guy who put the page up is SELLING that crap!
He claims "Let our slogan be - Whites should mate only with Whites for the preservation and expansion of nature's finest - The White Race!" ... I'll bet that good old Mother Nature is just SPINNING in her grave that she let this "gem" slip through the genetic pool.
Oh, it's not just the Caucasians who have the occasional problem with interracial dating... the Asians have their hang ups as well... my ex-fiance's Mom, a Chinese woman, had a problem with me at the beginning, seeing as I am of Japanese ancestry... mind you, when my ex explained to her that I was born and raised in Canada, that somehow made it all o.k. My own Mother has said that deep down she'd be "hurt" if I married an African-Canadian/American guy. I assured her that chances are I wouldn't be doing that, mainly because Samuel L. Jackson and Morgan Freeman are both a) married and b) a little too old for me, and while Wil Smith is closer to my age, he too is married.
I am definitely NOT against interracial marriage... both of my brothers have married non-Japanese women and NONE of my first cousins have married Japanese spouses.
Besides, I figure that if two people from differing races/cultures are happy together and have a happy life, then the world is all the better for it... there's WAAAAAAAAAAY too much hate and violence in the world today.
Hmmmm good question--I'm a christian, but an open-minded one of corse. And if you must know, my first BF was african-American. And I honestly think that if God created people of different rases especially, isn't it obvious the in his eyes, we're all the same, therefore, rases "coming together as a whole" was his intention? So if that doesn't already tell you, I don't see anything wrong with it.
The way I look at it is that interracial unions if made from love can be nothing but good for the world and can break down all the cultural barriors that we've put in place.
as for religion, my partner is a christian, but he knows and respects that I am an atheist and he doesn't pressure me to listen to his beliefs because he knows I have nothing but disdain for religion, so he doesn't mention it now.
Sweet thoughts. Smile.
Of course it is wrong! I went out with a white elephant once, and boy, her mother was very unhappy about our relationship. Since then, I've been only dating green mice.
hahahaha Good one!
Yeah, that website is terrible, but unfortunately it's an opinion that I heard a lot. It's hard to believe he would go as far as selling it, but obviously it does have a target audience, which is a shame.
there's nothing wrong with dating outside your race. it's simply personal preference. one's race is a part of them, but it doesn't define who they are. people need to be more open minded and let go of this mentality of "you have to date your own kind"
Like I said, I wouldn't do it again, because my family totally abandoned me last time, so I had no one to turn to when that relationship ended. Because of the circumstances, which were difficult enough, I felt much more isolated than I ever want to feel again. And I think deep down they still have doubts about me, even though its been over a year and I'm in a serious relationship now...
I can't understand why on earth you'd want to return to a family like that. I mean, it's sad that the relationship ended and that you were alone, but they chose to treat you in a completely disrespectful manner. why not just go to friends?
ditto to the last poster; I was gonna say the same thing. why the hell would you want anything to do with them considering the fact they weren't supportive of something that, at the time, probably meant a lot to you? I've been there with family not aproving of who I dated, or who I am as a person, so this is something I'm very passionate about. I've since realized that it's not worth having people in my life who can't completely accept me as I am...and find I'm much happier now than ever before. I've accepted myself, and know in my heart that anyone who claims I'm less of a person or whatever cause of who I date or any other reason, isn't worth my time and energy (be they family, friends...anyone).
good for you and huge hugs! You love your self and stay as you are. I'm sure you're a beautiful person.
It is against my religion to reject somebody because of their race, culture or religion. Judging people based on their race, culture or religion is wrong, and that applies to relationships.
God is good, right, kind, caring, fair and honest. I believe one should consider partners based on how much they meet those criteria. If somebody who meets all of those criteria wants to be with you and you want a relationship or a marriage, rejecting that person would be the same as rejecting God.
I'm a christian, and I feel that if the man/woman loves you for you, then there is no problem in it. Now, for me, I would rather date a fellow christian, but color or whatever else doesn't matter.
To the posters who asked me why I would go back to my family, Well, at the time I really didn't have any trustworthy friends either because where I went to school a lot of people didn't want anything to do with me because I was "different." If you went to a school for the blind you can probably relate to how much everyone, both students and staff, scrutinize everything you do if you don't fit into a certain standard, and how they will often abuse their power to do so. That's why I ended up completely alone after that relationship ended.
Makes me even more glad I didn't go to one of those places. The guy I knew referred to it as the 'Braille jail,' and if that's how they do things, sounds like he had a reason. More like, sounds like what members of cults / closely guarded religious sects do.
I went to a school for the blind, but I didn't let them push me around. it took awhile to figure out who wanted the best for me and who didn't...but ultimately, it had to come from within.
I'm not Christian, but I really think it's your business if you are willing or not willing to date outside your race culture religion.
Here from my own experience are some issues you may have to deal with: language barriers should the person be more comfortable with another language. If they have a different understanding of the English language than you do it can cause hardship. For example Mr Sponge understood a standard electronic form letter he read to be a rejection letter, when in fact it was saying "Thank you for your interest in Company __ and an open position. We will only call those we feel qualify for an interview." and they saw him as qualified, so he got the job. Sometimes it is possible to learn at least some phrases in that person's native tongue..the major languages, dialects, for example Mandarin Chinese, standard Arabic..other times it's not, like the less commonly spoken Indian & Chinese dialects, or regional patois, like certain forms of Arabic.
You too may have opposite ideas about everything from politics to parenting & family. For example a lot of Muslims think it's an adult child's obligation to care for elderly family members, I think that's not only a stupid reason to have a child but some relations with elders are so toxic they're better off in an institutional setting.
Get aquainted with that person's family, friends, the native cultural values and practices and any different religion before you make a committment, and if anything feels wrong...for example you don't like that person's choice of friends...at least give the relationship second thoughts if you decide against committing to it.
We have freedom of religion, and freedom of speech in this country, so we are all free to believe and express our beliefs if we so wish, we don't always make the rules, so we are free to choose what we believe, or who we wish to associate ourselves with, that's our right, and our freedom as long as we respect that others have the same rights and freedoms, even if we don't believe in their views.
One thing we should be sure to do is to make sure we know what we are talking about if we are going to characterize others beliefs.
So lets go to the source of what Christianity teaches about Christians marrying unbelievers.
2nd Corinthians 6:14,
Do not be yoked together with unbelievers. For what do righteousness and wickedness have in common? Or what fellowship can light have with darkness? end of verse.
The word unbeliever applies to all destitute of true faith. True pastors will caution their beloved children in the gospel, not to be unequally yoked. The effects of neglecting Scripture precepts as to marriages clearly appear. Instead of a help meet, the union brings a snare. Those whose cross it is to be unequally united, without their wilful fault, may expect support from the church, but when believers enter into such unions against the express warnings of God's word, they must expect much distress in their daily life as a result of it.
Well on to marrying outside your race, let's look at what the Bible says, here is a verse that some may use to support forbidding marrying outside your race, but if we take a closer look we will find out it cannot be used to support that position.
Ezra 9:2
They have taken some of their daughters as wives for themselves and their sons, and have mingled the holy race with the peoples around them. And the leaders and officials have led the way in this unfaithfulness." end of verse.
Some of the people disobeyed the express command of God, which forbade all marriages with the heathen. They exposed themselves and their children to the peril of idolatry, that had ruined their church and nation.
Deuteronomy 7:3-4,
3 Do not intermarry with them. Do not give your daughters to their sons or take their daughters for your sons, 4 for they will turn your sons away from following me to serve other gods, and the LORD's anger will burn against you and will quickly destroy you. end of verse.
So we see that scripture answers the question for us, it is not about race, but rather being unequally yoked with unbelievers.
Galatians 3:28-29,
28There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise. end of verse.
Although this passage doesn't refer to marriage specifically, it does tell us we are all equal in the sight of God, and there is no place for racism in Christianity.
I think that marrying within your race is a matter of preference, and not a Christian issue, everyone has their own preferences, and their is nothing wrong with that, just as some may prefer a sighted person, or a blind person, it may be just something they prefer. Ofcourse, it can also be from a racist attitude, which is another issue all together. We should remember that Christians believe that all of us are decendants of Adam an Eve, so when it comes right down to it, we all have the same origin, we are all one race of people.
Beautiful. Smile. Yes race has nothing to do with love, or Gods love. God created us all and as I have stated before I believe that the climent or place we are born has much to do with skin color. Natures way of making us adpted to the world we live in. If it were wrong to date someone out of your skin color then I suppose in the Heaven tof the people that believe it is wrong their will be separate sections? The white Heaven, the black Heaven, the spanish Heaven right? Mixing is mixing right? It is not God, or of God to believe in race, riches. If you say you are a Christian you are suppose to love your neighbor as your self right? Jesus did not pick his followers depending on race. Love whom you love and let God take care of the biggits.
If you're supposed to love your neighbour as yourself what do you do if your neighbour is a pagan or nonbeliever? Do you then love or hate yourself? If love then what's wrong with being in love with said neighbour and marrying him/her if he/she makes you truly happy? If all Christians are to follow the word of The Bible exactly as it was written, even if they only use the "accepted" books, there would be alot of strange things happening. To see what I mean, read the "Why can't I own a Canadian! Why?" post here.
http://www.zonebbs.com/boards.php?t=22492
It's under Jokes, but is very informative and definitely worth the read. Surely, those people who follow everything The Bible says would be doing all these things right? Now before you say no, think of this. It seems that, according to the philosophy presented in this thread, not doing them is picking and choosing what words of God to follow. And yet, most Christians do it. When was the last time you stoned someone to death, sold your daughter into slavery, refused to wear clothing made with two types of thread, refused shell fish because it's an "abomination" or burned a bull on the altar? So if you can do it for that, then marrying someone whom you love shouldn't cause a problem.
Sold your daughter into slavery? Well, I believe you are refering to Exodus 21, we are talking about a culture that existed thousands of years ago, so we have to dig a little to understand it, if we take a little closer look we will realize that the word slavery is used in a much broader sense than it is today. What we call an employee today, would have been refered to as a servant, or slave in that time period, even a high ranking officer may have been refered to as a servant or slave, the second most powerful person in Egypt next to the king was called a slave. In this case, the passage is refering to a daughter being given in marriage.
A father arranged for the marriage of his daughter by finding a suitable husband for her and negotiating the terms of the marriage." "When parents deemed their child to be approaching marriageable age, the father of the groom would contact the parents of the potential spouse and negotiate the terms of the marriage.
We can go through each issue and find the answer, if we take the time to find it.
Christ died on the cross becoming the sacraficial lamb, fulfilling the old testament laws of Moses, which is why the things you mentioned above are not practiced by Christians.
You can love your neighbor, but not like them, and as pointed out updating the bible to todays life would help you understand it better. I don't call myself a Christian, but a believer in God as I stated before, and the Bible is a guide to life not a "Christian" book.
Hello
I personally believe it is not wrong to date outside of your race but do think it is wrong to date people outside of your religion. Also I do and am sure will get a lot of negative feedback think that different races act in different ways. So I feel that you would need to make sure that you when dating outside your race find someone that is culturally like you.
What about someone who has no religion or who belongs to a very small minority. If I were to only date my fellow Hellenic Polytheists, while I'd still have a relatively large variety of people from whom I could choose, I'd also be missing out on a great many more. My boyfriend isn't one and we love each other and have been together for a little over three years now.
Well, I think the opposite is tru in that it is wrong not to date someone because of their race/culture/religion.
While I think that it is possible for cultural/religious differences to make a relationship unworkable, this is IMO something which needs to be discovered on an individual basis. You cannot simply write off someone because they are of x race or y religion. We are all individuals and while we are often shaped by the culture/religion in which we are raised, there are many other factors that shape the person we ultimately are. So for instance a muslim growing up in Saudi Arabia will have been differently affected by their faith than a muslim growing up in the UK, similarly a black/Japanese/Indian person raised in japan/Africa/India will have different ways/ideas than the Japanese/black/Indian person raised in London.
I Do think that religious/cultural differences are something that need to be taken into account if you are pursuing a more serious relationship, i.e. that you need to be aware of the differences and the potential impact they might have, but if the relationship is a serious one then this is something that would be discussed between the individuals concerned.
Surely we take people at face value and judge them on an individual basis as people, not according to what race/religion they represent?
Anyone who Wouldn't date someone based on their race/religion or who would be upset at a member of their family doing so is, quite frankly, nothing more than an ignorant bigot.
well said sb. it depends upon the individual's interest and how far they can adjust/llearn/understand one another.
true love will work out even if there's any differences.
Raaj.
So I guess that I'm an "ignorant bigot" just because I choose to go with white men? I never said I'd hurt anyone, it's just my preference. I suppose that, on the off chance that I honestly and truly fell in love with someone of another race, I would try to have a relationship with him and see where it went. If it was that strong, then not doing so might hurt me in the end. But if it never happens and if I'm satisfied, what's the problem?
the problem is you're limiting yourself; I think that's one thing SB is trying to say.
you don't have to be hurting someone to be bigoted.
and there's a difference between only ever having had relationships with white men because that's just how it's been, and actively discounting someone for being black.
racism. that's being named as preference.
some people.
Raaj.
well this is it raaj. And it then begs the question, if you have a "preference" for only white partners, does one then also have a "preference" for only white friends?
However, I do also have to take issue with a post further up:
"I think it would be a great experience to date a guy from another race/culture." don't we date people based on the attraction we feel towards them? rather than making it some kind of curiosity-satisfying exercise?
I think that you're thinking of dating strictly in the longterm romantic sence. There are also friends with benefits, where there's no relationship but where there is good friendship and sex. So for some, it may indeed be an interesting experience to have sex with someone outside of their race, whether or not they choose to "date" him/her. No, choosing only white partners does not necessarily mean choosing only white friends. I have friends from all different races. I just wouldn't want them in my bed.
Oh dear, you're really not doing yourself any favours here, are you?
"I think that you're thinking of dating strictly in the longterm romantic sence. There are also friends with benefits, where there's no relationship but
where there is good friendship and sex. So for some, it may indeed be an interesting experience to have sex with someone outside of their race," no, that argument still doesn't hold I'm afraid. After all, even a "friend" with benefits is, by definition, a friend? Presumably if you think enough of them to have sex with them (even if it's no-strings sex), you surely respect them as a person, enough not to use them as a tool to satisfy your curiosity over what it would be like to have sex with a person from a different race/culture/religion. Imagine if one of your friends said to you "you know, I've always been curious what it would be like to have sex with a blind person, and as you're my friend, shall we do it?" would you be up for that? Somehow I don't think that it would give you a warm fuzzy feeling knowing that you were being used as fodder to satisfy your friend's curiosity, would you?
Let's not forget that these are other human beings we're talking about here. And even if you're into meaningless sex with a friend, that person still deserves some respect.
"I have friends from all different
races. I just wouldn't want them in my bed." I have lots of friends I wouldn't want in my bed. But it has nothing to do with what colour they are.
People are people. I judge them as individuals. The colour of your skin does not make any difference to the kind of person you are, or how good/bad you are in bed.
And really, as a blind person, I find it quite astounding that something like skin colour would bother you anyway. It's not as if you can see it, is it?
Well, my first experience was with a friend not too much older than myself. Both of us were curious as to what it would be like to have sex. I was 17 at the time and wanted to wait until I was legal age, so a few days later, once I turned 18, he put on a condom and we tried it. If I wasn't already in a relationship, or if I truly felt comfortable about seeing other men, with my boyfriend's concent of course, and if I was really close to this friend and felt some attraction towards him, I wouldn't mind if he wanted to see what it was like to have sex with a blind person. I'd much rather someone be honest with me and tell me that's why he wanted to do it than to say nonsense about loving me, always wanting to be with me etc. I love my boyfriend for many reasons, certainly not just for sex. But I've never lied about the fact that him being much older than I is a big turn on for me.
thank you, Claire; I agree with your last post completely.
Tiffanitsa, your views are very sad...very sad indeed.
I don't see why they're sad at all. They're just realistic. It would be totally different if a stranger came up to me and said "hey blindy, let's hook up" or if, having had me reject him, a man continuously made advances towards me. But I see no issue with a friend expressing a desire to know what it would be like to have sex with someone who couldn't see. Actually, I can understand that one in a way. I mean, we need to touch alot more, to be more direct and can use our lack of sight in a very sensual way. What's wrong with being honest and stating what you want? How else can you hope to attain it?
lots of people have sex without love - that is not the point.
Even to both have sex because you're curious about what it would be like to have sex is an entirely different senario to having sex with someone because you wanted to know what it would be like to have sex with a person of a different race.
And really, why would someone want to do that? does being black/white/asian/mixed-race affect one's ability to perform in bed? No really - do people really believe that it does? Enough to disregard someone's feelings and want to try it for the sake of curiosity? And if so, in what way is it supposedly different?
" But I've never lied about the fact that him being much older than I is a big turn on for me." But we're not talking about turn-ons's here, we're talking about preferences for certain races, or more to the point, we are talking about your aversion to certain races, because that's what it is – let's not sugar-coat it.
We all have our preferences in terms of the physical trates we find attractive in others verses those we do not. Physically I prefer taller men to shorter ones maybe because that gives me a sense of security/safeness, you prefer older men, perhaps that is because of their perceived experience both in life and on a more physical level, someone who can see might prefer other physical features, long legs/big breasts (in a woman) etc.
But to express a preference based on someone's race has no other basis than prejudice. Even more so when you cannot even see the colour of the person you are rejecting on those grounds.
And somehow, I don't imagine that a person of a different race to you would see your views as anything other than racist. Do your non-white friends know that you would never date a non-white person?
How can it be a disregard of someone's feelings if they're willing to do it? Certainly, if they're not and if you push the issue it is, but if they say it's fine with them, then what's the problem? You're both having a good time and enjoying each other. I don't see the difference between wanting to be with someone who has long legs versus wanting to be with someone because they're from another race. Both are sparked by curiosity, sometimes by desire. Some white men, for example, find black women more attractive than their white counterparts. Is that not a preference? Some women want to try a black man because they've heard that black males have larger penises or an Asian one because they're supposed to have smaller than average ones. What's the difference between that and a man who likes a woman with big breasts? I've often heard that yes, certain races/ethnicities are better than others in bed. Of course, this isn't always necessarily true any more than the stereotypes of penis size, but it's definitely something about which to be curious and to want to discover for onesself. I also think that there must be some truth in it for the stereotypes to continue for so long. Part of race is indeed physical traits, even if it's something as simple as the colour of one's skin. If expressing preference based on race is prejudice, then any other preference must be seen in the same light. So because I don't want to date a man who weighs 500 lbs., who has tons of hair on his chest or who's younger than I, does that make me prejudice? Why doesn't my attraction to older men make me prejudice or is it just because I'm not totally against dating younger ones that makes it a preference in your mind? If not, than what's wrong with me wanting to date white men? And let me add that I probably wouldn't consider *all* white men. Ethnicity plays an important role in my decisions and I don't mean whether they're Greek or not. There are many cultures throughout the world, some with which I can relate and some with which I cannot. So if I found a white man with completely different views from mine, different enough that they would lead to fighting etc. I wouldn't go with him strictly because of his skin colour. Likewise, other races have their own cultures, and while it may be fun and interesting for some to explore those, I wouldn't prefer to do so with a sex partner unless we were seriously involved with each other. There are also certain things from the Greek culture that I love, that turn me on and most nonGreeks wouldn't be able to relate to many of them. Some Greeks can't even understand them because they have different interests than I. I don't intend on having children, but if I did, then that would be another thing to consider. How would we bring up a child if our races and/or cultures were so dramatically different? As I said, be anyone's friend, regardless of race, and in most cases, ethnicity. I'm sure that most of my friends know by now that I wouldn't date someone outside of my race and none of them seem to have any problems with it. As I said, it's a preference.
Personally, I don't get the concept about blind people being less prejudiced than sighted ones. When I was in the relationship I referred to earlier in this thread, I once tried to tell my parents that I didn't care about skin color because I couldn't see it anyway, and my dad said, "just because your eyes don't work doesn't mean your brain doesn't! You know he's black, so I don't care!" That was the gist of it anyway. When I thought about that for awhile, while his specific reasoning for saying it might have been wrong, the point does still stand that vision or lack thereof doesn't erase or cause prejudices. It may seem silly for a blind person to care about something superficial or something they don't understand such as colors, but the truth is that some do, because, as my dad pointed out, there's nothing wrong with our intelligence, and we take information in the same way sighted people do. I do think because of my own personal experiences I became more tolerant and open-minded while my parents were set in their ways. I had to grow up much faster than most people, and had a lot of bad experiences that increased my compassion for others. So, while I wouldn't necessarily date someone outside my race again because of the problems and complications it caused me, it's not because my previous experience made me bitter or intolerant. The reason that relationship ended was because the guy, while claiming he loved me and while we made plans to move in together, was really cheating on me with his ex for over half of the course of our relationship. I went through a huge internal struggle because I'd invested so much in him--all the other relationships in my life were destroyed, I'd lost my faith in God, I was even very close to attempting suicide in the beginning of our relationship because my family told me to choose him or them. I was 17 at the time, and had I not been blind, I know they would have disowned me in a heartbeat, but I guess they had enough sense not to throw a blind person out on the street. Of course, at times I wish they had, since I know deep down they'll never forget what happened. I did finally decide to leave him, because cheating was one thing I'll never stand for, but I very nearly did allow him to keep treating me that way for the simple fact I felt so dirty and ashamed that no one else would love me, even if they never knew what I'd done.
Luckily, I was proven wrong. I've been in a wonderful relationship with my current boyfriend for almost 2 years now, and he does tell me things like God would forgive me because it wasn't wrong in the first place, but to be honest I don't believe it. I still think I'm going to hell and at times it weighs very heavy on my heart. With my increasing maturity and other circumstances the relationship between my parents and I has deteriorated even more, but I'm slowly learning not to let that hurt me because my boyfriend's family pretty much accepts me as one of their own. I still have to force myself to believe that too because I never really had great relationships with my own family to begin with. The point is, although I personally choose not to enter another inter-racial relationship, mostly because I don't think I'll be looking for any other rlationships anytime soon anyway, I wouldn't discourage others from doing so either. It can, especially in one's teenage years, be incredibly empowering to break the boundaries of social norms, no matter how much it hurts, there is some exhiliration in it. But more importantly, all we had was each other, and it made our relationship stronger, at least for awhile. The kind of bond me and that guy had, while I know I wasted it on him, was incredible. All I can say for others who find themselves in this situation is to somehow build a support network. I didn't have it, and it nearly cost me my life, although now that I'm older I don't know if I'd react the same way either.
True, and many blacks, at least in the United States, go out of their way to make themselves different in their speech and choice of clothing, music etc. Obviously, there are some great exceptions and some truly can't help it because of how and where they were brought up, and some white people have even picked up on these things now, I guess to be "cool". But it's pretty easy to tell a nonwhite at least when compared with a black. Then, you have the stupid talk shows like Jerry Springer and the media, both of which show blacks, so-called white trash and other races constantly cheating on each other, making scenes, refusing to take care of children that they chose to bring into the world, abusing their partners and likewise. Obviously, there are self-respecting people of all these races who would never dream of doing any of these things and who probably abhore these shows. I know of a wonderful black woman who started out extremely poor and who has a daughter and is slowly moving up the ladder of success. There's nothing that she wouldn't do for her little girl and she's very respectful, caring and decent. I'd rather be friends with her any day over a college grad who was nasty or selfish etc. But the fact still stands that the media is at least partly responsible for the ways in which we view race and so on and yes, it can often play a part in who we choose for partners and in our reasons for doing so. I can't understand why you would think you're going to hell but we come from very different backgrounds. I hope, though, that you realise just how beautiful you are as a person and that you know now that you're loved. It sounds like your boyfriend is doing an excellent job there.
"How can it be a disregard of someone's feelings if they're willing to do it?" Because even asking if they would shows a complete lack of respect for them, both as individuals and in terms of their race. If you have respect for someone as an individual then there are certain boundaries which you simply do not cross.
" what's wrong with me wanting to date white men? And let me add that I probably wouldn't consider *all* white men." There you've just answered your own question. Because while you wouldn't consider all white men, you wouldn't consider any men of other races. And that is where the line is crossed between preference and prejudice.
"So if I found a white man with completely different views from mine, different enough that they would
lead to fighting etc. I wouldn't go with him strictly because of his skin colour." No. But if you found a black/asian/mixed-race man with the same views as yours, you would still not go with him, because of his skin colour. Again, preference verses prejudice. You would rule out individual white men based on the trates you did nt find compatible, yet you would rule out all men of other races based on their race alone.
" I don't intend on having children, but if I did, then that would be another thing to consider.
How would we bring up a child if our races and/or cultures were so dramatically different?" As I said in my first post above, if a relationship is serious then of course cultural differences would need to be addressed, and in some instances that might perhaps make a relationship unworkable. But again, you need to address those types of issues on an individual basis, not put everyone of the same race/culture/religion into the same category. And of course there are certain lifestyles that one might consider incompatible. For instance I probably wouldn't go looking for a man among the tribes of the amazon purely because I couldn't see myself uprooting to go and live in a rain forest or someone leaving behind their simple life to come and live in the UK. But the son of the amazon-dwelling man might have come over here as a child and be a totally different person with different views and lifestyle to those of his family, which in turn would make him a different prospect altogether and perhaps our lives would be more compatible.
ST said: " Personally, I don't get the concept about blind people being less prejudiced than sighted ones." Yes to an extent I agree with you on that, but it depends on the basis for the prejudice. People who are racially prejudiced are usually so based not on skin colour alone but on perceptions of the demographic which they represent. A preference for someone with blonde hair/blue eyes/big boobs is based on physicality alone, and is therefore a preference. And someone who was blind couldn't pheasibly express a preference for being with a blonde/blue-eyed person since he/she cannot see them.
But a "preference" for someone with white skin is not based on the physicality of being white – it is based on the perception of the demographics which the non-white person represents, and is therefore a prejudice. Because if you got to know someone who was black and you didn't know they were black, and then found out later down the line that they were, that would alter your perception of them, based on the prejudices you feel towards other races.
And to be honest I think you can't have it both ways – either you're prejudiced, or you're not. If you're open-minded enough to have friends who are of a different race/culture to you, then there is no reason why you couldn’t become attracted to one of them. If you feel that you could never become attracted to someone of a different race, then IMO you have to question just how genuine your friendship is towards others of different races, and how accepting you really are of them.
" Then, you have the stupid
talk shows like Jerry Springer and the media, both of which show blacks, so-called white trash and other races constantly cheating on each other, making
scenes, refusing to take care of children that they chose to bring into the world, abusing their partners and likewise." Well Jerry springer and his illk (his equivalent over here is Jeremy kyle) appeal to the lowest common denominator – i.e. the types of people that watch those types of shows are the types of people who often fall into the wife-beating/drug-using categories themselves,, or who find other peoples' car-crash lifestyles entertaining.
Yes, the media Does have a lot to answer for in terms of how certain demographics are portrayed, e.g. over here we have the daily mail that represents single parents as benefit-scroungers who have several children by several different men, queuing up at the dole office to collect their benefits along with the hoards of immigrants who have stepped off the eurostar and are here to take our jobs and houses.
But the thing is, it's not the media's fault that people believe these claims – we are all individuals capable of our own thoughts and making our own independent judgements.
I grew up in a country where, until not so long ago, prejudice was part of the constitution. I.e. I grew up in South Africa. There it's pretty hard to escape the division between different races – even now.
And yet I don't subscribe to the beliefs about stereotypes and I take people as I see them – as people, not as representatives of some demographic.
People have prejudices because they choose to.
If you are prejudiced the only person to blame for that is yourself. Yes you may have some influences that have shaped your beliefs, but ultimately we all have to take responsibility for the way we think and feel and believe, and then for the impact those feelings and thoughts and beliefs have on others.
I don't understand why blind people are looking at the colours even though they are unable to look at the colour differences? if they say they won't go with a man from other culture/religion means we can justify it as it's their own choice. as some cannot tollerate or adjust to the other culture/religion.
as per me,
I won't go with a girl who she cannot communicate with me. or in another words, who she's not knowing my known languages.
I won't go with a girl who never care her physic and stinks.
I won't go with a girl who she's having a manly voice.
I won't go with a girl who she isn't honest.
I won't go with a girl who prefer to sleep with someone even after committing a relationship. FWB or whatever.
I won't go with a girl who she's having 0 boobs.
On the other hand, I will never ever look at her colour/religion...
The another thing which I'm unable to digest here is, tif said that she won't look those differences for her FWB's.
I wonder! how come it's being possible to accept someone in bed without love? So casual love has no limitations but partnership love has restrictions?
Black or white, the hole must be tight. lol.
I'm this way. we all are human. colour differences is not our mistake. Religions are our own inventions. cultural differences are also not a natural ones.
Raaj.
once again, very well said, Claire; I couldn't have said it better.
To SugarBaby: As I said, If I really fell in love with a man from another race,, I'd have to seriously consider what to do. I would probably be willing to accept some races and ethnicities over others more quickly, but in the end, my heart would have to make the decision, not just my head. So while I'm not ruling it out, I'm also not specifically looking for an interracial relationship either. What if the blind person wanted someone blond/blue-eyed person because he/she looked like a certain race? I don't mean this in any kind of Nazi way, but I'd personally like (not exclusively of course) it if my man had that Greek (dark hair/dark eyes) look about him. I can't see it but others can. That said, if someone excludes potential partners just because of something as superficial as eye/hair colour, not because they personally find them attractive but because of what society would think, there's something wrong with them. Then again, what if they just like how one looks over the other? What if that were true with race too, with a sighted person? That is, what if it wasn't culturally based but was honestly a visual thing and the person liked one skin colour over another? By your logic, that wouldn't be prejudice because it's purely physical.
Why do I have to be willing to sleep with my friends in order for my relationships to be genuine? I have certain friends who would rather date in their own race and they've shown me nothing but kindness and good friendship. What about the fact that I want to be with a man who's sighted so that he can help me with things and so that we can drive places on our own or one who could hear so that it's easier for me to communicate with him etc? Is there a possibility of an older man going blind or deaf? Sure? Would I leave my boyfriend if, Gods forbid, something that tragic were to happen to him? Hell no! But why should I have to be willing to seek these kinds of people out, whether it be a man of another race or a disabled one and why can't I have a Hispanic deaf and/or blind friend but not be willing to sleep with him?
I have to agree with the immigrant idea. Not all, of course, are like this. There are many immigrants who work very hard and who honestly want to integrate into the culture of their new country while still preserving their own heritage. But there are far too many refugees being accepted into the country (and I mean America too not just Greece) who are taking jobs away from the natives and too many illegals. There's also a huge propencity, in America, to cater to a certain group by putting everything in their language instead of demanding that they learn English.
I personally agree with segrigation in some instances, so long as it truly is separate but equal and no one is being abused because of their race. It doesn't have to be forced by law either. I think that a company should have the right to hire whomever they want and not have to succumb to quotas, and the same goes for schools. It's not fair if a student can't get into a school just because the quota of another race hasn't been met. And what if a company or school wanted to hire/accept people of a given race/ethnicity because that was it's focus? Likewise with communities who may wish to keep the ethnic/racial makeup in tact. I live in a town that, for a very long time, was purely white, and even that could be broken down by specific ethnicities that tended to move here. Now, we're seeing a trickling (much more so in the next town over and in surrounding areas) of other races, specifically black, Hispanic and possibly Indian in town. I'm sure of the first two at least. In any case, even if I loved them to death, the fact still remains that certain races/cultures bring down property values. Now are there Spanish speaking who speak wonderful English and who are educated and blacks who would never dream of vandalising and who take care of their houses and families? Of course. I find this is especially true with blacks from Africa and Spaniards. But enough of them in general aren't like this that it causes problems for home owners. Perhaps, there should be some kind of screening (for all races) to see how well they can take care of things and fit in a community before they're allowed to move there. Speaking of which, I think that cultural enclaves help to form and strengthen communities. This is certainly not always the case either. But in general, I think that they provide a wonderful opportunity to keep heritage and customs alive. Astoria New York used to be pretty much a Greek neighbourhood, especially in certain parts. Sadly, all these other ethnicities/races are moving in and the Greeks are moving out, and so another cultural treasure is being lost. This is happening all over the country with all sorts of cultures.
To Raajy: What if there is a woman with small breasts and a deep voice who is perfect in every other way? Would you accept her? Friends with benefits are just that. Yes, I would still have the same restrictions. However, in general, fwbs are not serious relationships. They're friends who have agreed to have sex with each other. But making a committment to a person and saying that you'll stay with him/her no matter what is very different from simply having sex with him/her. So while a difference in culture might not matter as much with a friend, it might be a huge deal if you want to truly settle down with someone, to live with him/her and learn his/her ways etc. Also, whereas fwbs can be experimental, just to see what something is like, I think it's completely wrong to look at a real relationship in that way.
I think I am actually lost for words. … almost.
The thing with people having one preference over another is that as a rule, superficial preferences such as blonde hair or blue eyes are rarely deal-breakers. I.e. I don't know anyone who would say "oh, he/she has green eyes, that's a definite no-no," and frankly anyone who is that shallow isn't likely to be indulging in long-lasting, deep relationships anyway because they are never satisfied.
So while we might write off a preference for blonde hair or blue eyes or yes, black/white/olive complection as a superficial preference rather than out-and-out prejudice, I don't think those kinds of people are necessarily the most tolerant of individuals anyway. Anyone that can write someone off purely on the basis of a superficial physicality is most likely to hold less tolerant views on more underlying trates…
" What about the fact that I want to be with a man who's sighted so that he can help
me with things and so that we can drive places on our own or one who could hear so that it's easier for me to communicate with him etc? Is there a possibility
of an older man going blind or deaf? Sure? Would I leave my boyfriend if, Gods forbid, something that tragic were to happen to him? Hell no! But why should
I have to be willing to seek these kinds of people out, whether it be a man of another race or a disabled one and why can't I have a Hispanic deaf and/or
blind friend but not be willing to sleep with him?
But who is seeking people out? Surely it's not about actively looking for people (and how many of us seriously actively go out looking for a person to date, they tend to come along rather than the other way around), it's about taking the people we meet and get to know at face value, and getting to know them as individual people before writing them off because of their race/disability/religion.
One might find it hard to have a relationship with a deaf person perhaps because of a communication barrier, equally it might be difficult with someone who speaks a different language. But you just don't know that until you get to know them as people, and often the chemistry might ot be there if communication is difficult. However to not even contemplate having a relationship with someone on the basis the ir blindness would preclude them from being ble to drive is pretty shallow in my view. What about sighted people that don't drive? And they do exist too – would you write off a potential partner on the basis he didn't have a driver's licence? Or insist he take his test before you would agree to go out with him?
Given you're quite happy to discriminate against blind people in terms of their relationship prospects, I presume you are perfectly understanding of the fact that men might not want to date you because you are blind?
" I have to agree with the immigrant idea. Not all, of course, are like this. There are many immigrants who work very hard and who honestly want to integrate
into the culture of their new country while still preserving their own heritage. But there are far too many refugees being accepted into the country (and
I mean America too not just Greece) who are taking jobs away from the natives and too many illegals." Firstly, you're confusing "refugees" (or asylum seekers as they are known over here) with "immigrants.. There is a vast difference. Refugees are people that are fleeing persecution in their own countries and go to other countries because they feel they have no choice. On what basis do you believe we should turn these people away?
While there should perhaps be immigration caps to prevent so many people actually emigrating here, it's worth remembering that were it not for immigration, many things that are part of every day life to us now wouldn't be here. Where do you think your local Chinese/Italian restaurants came from? Or the curry you order n a Friday night (as is customary in the UK)?
Also, it's worth bearing in mind that many of the most menial jobs are done by immigrants, most of the cleaning jobs for instance that many people think are below them wouldn’t be done if there weren't immigrants.
And lastly, given you are an American, if you ever actually make it to Greece, you will be an immigrant. How do you reconcile saying that immigrants shouldn't come to your country and take over your jobs etc when you one day hope to be one of them?
But to add to that actually, " Astoria New York used to be pretty much a Greek neighbourhood, especially in certain parts. Sadly, all these other ethnicities/races are moving
in and the Greeks are moving out, and so another cultural treasure is being lost." These would all be greeks that came here as immigrants? To America? So greek culture not American? You can't select which migrated cultures you are happy to see in a country and which you are not.
to add to the last post, has it ever occured to you that maybe your boyfriend is with you simply cause he feels sorry for you?
maybe that isn't the case, but I'm simply giving you food for thought since you seem to not think of the big picture most of the time, and are outwardly refusing to date anyone for incredibly shallow reasons such as race/insisting they have sight.
and I thought I had seen it all...
To SugarBaby: When I was single, I found my men by going on Craigslist, OKCupid and Adult Friend Finder. So I did actively seek them out. So while I did get to know them and while I wasn't sure in the beginning whether they'd work out for me, it was assumed that we were heading towards a sexual goal. Only my first partner was friends with me for years before our encounter, the first for both of us. That said, I'm still regular friends with most of the men whom I've had, not that I've had alot but anyway. I wouldn't necessarily write off a sighted person because he didn't drive. It might even be a good thing if he was older or just uncomfortable with the idea. But it would definitely make things more difficult and less spontanius. That said, he could still help in other visual ways, so it might balance itself out. But it really depends on whether I was going for an fwb, whom I might occasionally see, or a real relationship, whom I would wish to see more often. But as happened with Spiros and I, fwbs can certainly turn into real relationships, and in this case, not having a car would be something to work through if we wanted to be together more frequently. To be honest, I had an online relationship with a blind man that lasted well over a year and I truly loved him. He was from Greece but living in england, and when he tried to come to America, things just didn't work out. So no, i wouldn't totally rule out someone blind. But yes, I could understand if a man didn't want to date me because of my blindness, though more so if he was unwilling to start a real relationship than if he didn't want to just have fun.
Yes, there is a different between refugees and immigrants. But Greece, at least, has far too many of them. I could understand that many of them flee from situations where, for example, rape is ignored and that is horrible. But each country has it's own citizens and legal immigrants to consider. There are poor people right here in America, and yet the government gives abroad instead of helping it's own. People adopt, again, from other countries when there are children just as worthy and needing of homes here. Some of these refugees, I'm sure, will want to stay in their new country and build a real life for themselves, integrating into society etc. just as regular immigrants do. Still, since they came in a rush, the odds of them knowing the native language are slim. So now money has to be spent to teach them, since they wouldn't have enough for private schooling. That, or they take more low-level jobs away from the natives. I think caps are an excellent idea. I mean, I wouldn't like to be told, when I eventually get to Greece, that I'm not allowed because they exceeded their quota, but it's still understandable. There's a difference between a decent amount of immigrants entering the country and a huge number entering at once. I guess I'm so sensitive to this because I keep hearing about it when I read the news. Some islands have even asked the government for help, since they're now far too overpopulated and yet more immigrants are trying to move to them. And in my personal life, I've met far too many people who don't know English. Some want to learn and I commend them. But others refuse both to learn and to teach their children and want everything in their language. And what's worse, they get it!
You're absolutely right about me eventually being an immigrant, and yes, I will be taking a job away from someone. But if the job is teaching English to the blind, considering that I'm a native English speaker and blind, I'm probably more qualified than some other people. Even if it's not that job, I'm working my butt off learning the language so that when I go there, I'm not ignorant and I also intend on integrating as much as possible into Hellenic culture. I'm going there as someone who truly loves the country, who wants to spend the rest of her life there and who is willing to serve it any way possible, not as someone merely seeking work or an experience in a foreign land.
To fighter of love and life: Leave it to you to come up with something like that. After three years of being with him, I can say as a matter of absolute surity that my boyfriend is not with me because he feels sorry for me. In fact, he likes me to try things on my own and is amazed at some of the stuff that I can do. The amount of love that he's shown me could never be faked or simply given out of pitty. So yes, thankfully, I'm lucky in that regard and have someone who loves me for who I am.
and let me guess, you take his being amazed willingly. what a shame.
I'm not saying he's amazed at stupid things like "wow, you can hang up your coat". It's just that he's learned alot, as have I, during our time together. He's had some blind friends so wasn't all that nieve. But, for instance, when he first saw my skills at using a chef's nice to chop and mince things, he was amazed. Now, he thinks nothing of it and the same goes with other stuff.